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  • aziz 3:50 am on August 12, 2011 Permalink
    Tags: Dan Simmons, , Orson Scott Card, science fiction   

    I see Dan Simmons made NPR’s list of top 100 SciFi/Fantasy. Regrettable, since the man is a rightwing islamophobic loon.

    I’ve interacted directly with him on the web – see these two posts from CoB v1.0, The Century War with Islam(-phobia) and Dan Simmons responds.. sorta

    also I did make a brief foray into Simmon’s web forum and had a thoroughly unpleasant experience. At one point, Simomons “invited” me to consider a gedanken experiment:

    In this case, the Thought Experiment is this – What might the world be like in 2006 if Islam did not exist?

    Now, before accusations of advocating genocide come cascading in, please not that I’m not asking us to imagine that the people in all Islamic nations and cultures did not exist, merely the religion-ideology as a ruling and unifying fabric in those nations and cultures. In that sense, this might be compared to someone in 1940 Europe asking – “What would this continent be like if National Socialism and fascism did not exist?” The German and Italian people, no longer unified by the transformative-beliefs, would still be very much alive and working and reading and taking their children to parks, etc.

    Ah, I see! Islam, National Socialism, fascism! Understood?

    My beef with Orson Scott Card is similar, though I haven’t blogged about it. Read Card’s own essay and see for yourself:

    http://www.ornery.org/essays/warwatch/2005-05-15-1.html

     

    • aziz 3:58 am on August 12, 2011 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      though, one thing of value from that experience was a recommendation for novels by George Alec Effinger, A Fire In The Sun, When Gravity Fails and The Exile Kiss – all of which apparently feature a muslim protagonist. Will add that to my List.

    • Anon 7:47 am on August 20, 2011 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      He may be an Islamophobe, but he’s an amazing writer. Illium/Olympos was fantastic, literally and figuratively.

  • aziz 10:41 pm on March 22, 2011 Permalink
    Tags: , science fiction   

    Wouldn’t 2:259 make for an awesome science fiction story? genetics, cryogenics, the singularity, artificial intelligence… it all could be there

     

    • Maitham 2:02 pm on March 23, 2011 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      A powerful aya, for sure… I was wondering, where do you see the artificial intelligence in it?

  • plimfix 10:13 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink
    Tags: , , science fiction   

    Islam and Science Fiction features an interview with proggy Pamela K. Taylor. I’d be particularly interested to hear people’s views in respect of this:

    In the global Muslim community, I think fiction in general is a hard sell. A lot of Muslim cultures have no tradition of fiction; it’s a relatively new form. Also, the segment of our society that is religious, and that is appears to be a fairly large segment, has a suspicion of fiction — they see fiction as stories for children or lies or worse as a license for immorality. Obviously, there are plenty of Muslims around the world who do not view fiction that way. And certainly in the American Muslim community reading for pleasure has been embraced by the younger generation whose social outlets are often tightly controlled by parents. That group seems to be very interested and eager for science fiction and fantasy.

    I’m not sure if Pamela is making reference to “Islamic Fiction”, a topic that previously led to a heated debate between myself and its principle US protagonist.

     

    • Shams al-Nahar 10:38 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      AMG …. “non-preachy”????

    • Abu Noor Al-irlandee 11:10 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Plimfix,

      The quoted paragraph from Ms. Taylor seems accurate to me.

      I didn’t click ghrough to all of the links and just read a little bit of your previous debates regarding Islamic fiction.

      As for myself, I think attempts to prevent American Muslims from reading secular fiction, like almost any attempts in our place and time to shield ourselves and our children from the mainstream culture, are basically doomed to fail, and this reality hangs over any attempt to discuss whether it would be good or bad if they could succeed, making such discussions basically hypothetical.

      My own children read all kinds of children’s fiction, (in fact I am molding my 10 year old daughter to become an author of a series of books involving a Muslim girl detective) although I don’t find concerns about fiction in general, or about the content of fiction, to be silly on their face.

      I find your claim (as I understand it) that all art is amoral by definition to be absurd and bizarre. Saying that art can deal with immoral subject matters in a moral or possibly amoral way is true, but it can certainly also deal with such suject matters in an immoral way. Simply calling something art does not raise it above some realm of morality. And if art contains messages, and art which appeals to me often contains messages, those messages can certainly be moral or immoral. In fact, fiction can even deal with halal subject matters in an immoral way, and perhaps this is true of a very large section of children’s entertainment of all type which proliferate in the world today, which is filled with messages of materialism and of what is important in life, especially with regard to young girls in our culture.

      This is actually my biggest concern about younger Muslims entering into the realms of the mainstream arts in societies which seem to embrace this notion of art (which perhaps is every society). As a consumer of artistic products (basically books and movies, but in the past music as well) I have a fear that the notion you propogate here (that art is amoral) is widespread among artsy types and anyone entering that sphere will constantly be encouraged away from containing moral messages in their work and even more obviously, will be constantly to “push the envelope” with regard to content and subject matter, making the mere fact that one talks about seemingly risque subject matters a virtue in itself (see the bizarrely overblown coverage that those like Michael Muhammad Knight get in the mainstream).

      Of course, if art is good, the moral message will not be delivered in an obvious way, but in a subtle and beautiful way. And I am not necessarily saying that all art has to be either moral or immoral but it contains messages and many of those messages are certainly immoral, and I don’t really see how one can deny that.

      • Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 11:21 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        If one wished to more substantively address the Islamic attitude to arts, one would probably be wise to start with looking at the way the Qur’an and Sunnah dealt with poetry. The Prophet (saw) did not completely forbid poetry and sometimes even encouraged certain people to engage it, but both he and Allah (swt) himself in the Qur’an also have very negative things to say about Poetry and poets.

        I think you will find that the view of the Qur’an and the Sunnah is that some art is moral, some is immoral, and some is okay in certain doses but should not become the center of one’s life.

        Allah knows best.

        • shams 11:32 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

          asalamu alaikum Warahmatullahi aabarakatuh, brother, but much of the Qur’an is sapentia poetica. The Prophet became the leader of the people with the burdha ode, and my reversion (like many) was seeded by the poetry of Ghazali and Arabi and Hallaj.

          • Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 11:43 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

            Wa ‘alaykum as salaam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh Sister Shams,

            Not sure exactly what it means to say the Qur’an is “sapentia poetica.” Allah (swt) himself confirms that the Qur’an is not poetry.

            Other than that, do you see what you said as contradicting what I wrote? In what way? I never said all poetry is haram, in fact I explicitly said some poetry was moral and in fact encouraged by the Prophet (saw).

            My own opinion on the particular authors or works you mentioned is not really important to this discussion. I am satisfied to agree that some poetry or any other art is “good” in the sense of morally good, and some is “bad” in the sense of morally bad….I am not under the illusion that we will all necessarily agree on which is which. :)

            • shams 1:28 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink

              but the short suras are poetry…the memetic evolution of the arabian ode and the mullaqat…the Prophet would of course encourage any poetry that benefitted the people and forbid any that harmed the people.
              sapentia poetica means the wisdom of poetry…from the greek, from Aristole’s Ars Poetica.

              how can Ghazali or Arabi not be important?
              i dont understand….

            • shams 1:55 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink

              Bismallah…do you know what learned from following Arwi’s link to Ayatollah Khomenei’s poetry? shariah is the social compact of islamic government.
              epiphany. :)

          • thabet 11:43 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

            Do you read the burda?

            • shams 1:32 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink

              is that for me? of course i read it.

            • Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 2:23 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink

              If, on the other hand, that was for me…. of course I do not. :)

            • shams 4:43 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink

              oh brother thabet…. look up! ^^
              mikelyons is in ur base killin ur doodz.

            • thabet 3:11 am on October 15, 2010 Permalink

              Nah, Lyons can’t kill anyone. Let him reveal himself to be the Nazi and racist sympathiser he obviously is.

            • thabet 4:10 am on October 15, 2010 Permalink

              re: burda. Abu N/Shams, answers as expected! :-)

    • Arwi 11:55 am on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      What Muslim culture has no tradition of fiction?! She is using fiction as a synonym for novel, which omits numerous forms of imaginary narratives. On the contrary, I would say that fantasy fiction from Muslim cultures has been an important influence on canonical European writers from Boccaccio to Salman Rushdie.

      • shams 1:29 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        yes! and my beloved Arabian Nights. :)

        • Yakoub/plimfix 1:45 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

          @ Awri and @Shams Ditto my thoughts, plus there’s stuff like Maqama.

          I wouldn’t accept the arguments made herein against Wilde’s view that art is, of itself, amoral. I agree Wilde was writing before discourse theory, and I doubt he envisaged the likes of American Psycho. However, in the context to his time, I suspect Wilde was berating moralising art, and rightly so. My mummy taught me right from wrong when I was a little boy, but I’m now a grown up, and desire to be treated as such. Fiction is about getting inside other people’s imaginations, not hearing their sermons. You might argue people are influenced. True, But weight up the moral impact of the arts, against the monumental impact of a disingenous, sensationalist, hypocritical, voyeuristic, daily mass media.

          • Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 2:18 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

            Yakoub,

            I understand that Wilde and you are pushing back against something here, but I’m sorry I’m not going to let your argument off that easy.

            It simply doesn’t stand up to scrutiny.

            The idea that morality is only for children and not for sophisticated adults is nonsense. Same can be said for sermons actually.

            Bad sermons and bad art are not for anybody. Good sermons or other forms of morals teaching are good for anybody.

            The idea that art is amoral can only stand if, at the root of it, one thinks that morality itself is artificial or false. Otherwise, there are messages in art and things being taught and conveyed, and they can certainly be measured against a standard of morality. That some may do such measurements badly, or focus on the wrong things, is a criticism of how they are doing it, not a proof that art is amoral.

            Similarly with your argument about media. What are you considering “media” and what are you considering “art”? So if FoxNews calls itself “Art” then it should be treated as amoral, right?

            • Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 2:22 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink

              In case it is not clear enough, I am not arguing that every work of art should be in the form of a sermon. Truly understanding others and their experiences can certainly be a moral pursuit and is in fact a commandment from Allah (swt) in more than one place in the Qur’an. So work that does so can indeed be moral.

            • Arwi 8:16 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink

              It simply doesn’t stand up to scrutiny.

              Indeed, it doesn’t stand up to the scrutiny of Wilde’s own oeuvre, which include such blatantly moralizing works as A Woman of No Importance and The Happy Prince. But W was being playful, so to address it with too much po-faced seriousness is as much a mistake as believing Khomeini was seriously opposed to mosques in the poem I quoted earlier.

              I think that art is too wide-ranging a term to generalize about its (a)morality, there are works in which moral questions are central like A Woman of No Importance, and works in which they are peripheral, like Earnest.

            • Abu Noor 6:51 am on October 15, 2010 Permalink

              Arwi, I assure you I was not po faced…do I have to put a smiley on every comment? :)

          • Arwi 8:26 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

            I agree Wilde was writing before discourse theory

            Hilarious. But anyway, how does art have the power to be humanizing without having the power to be dehumanizing? What is this scale of profound humanizing, anyway? How do you distinguish someone who has been slightly humanized by reading three or four chapters from someone who has been profoundly humanized by shelves upon shelves? As Katha Pollitt wrote in her essay on the canon, if this were true, lit profs would be signally virtuous, instead of being as much jerks as anyone but with better vocabularies.

    • Yakoub/plimfix 2:35 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Central to my argument is, art, and especially fiction, is humanizing because it offers the opportunity to step inside another person’s imagination in a way which is extraordinarily intimate and quite possibly unique in respect of interpersonal communication. That why art is profoundly humanizing. Moralizing is the enemy of that function. But that thesis needs an example to support it. Blog to follow…

    • Yakoub/plimfix 11:29 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

    • Yakoub/plimfix 11:32 pm on October 14, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      lit profs would be signally virtuous, instead of being as much jerks as anyone but with better vocabularies.

      Funny, ALL the stupid fundis I’ve ever met – Muslim and Christian — have been science/technology/medical students or graduates.

      • Abu Noor 6:53 am on October 15, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        Yakoub, I don’t know if you consider me a “stupid fundi” (I hope not) but I hate science/technology/medicine….(math, too, actually) :)

      • shams 6:53 am on October 15, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        i have never met a fundie science or technology student in physics or math, or, of course, in biology. Because of teh Satan Evolution.
        where do you go to school?

      • Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 8:54 am on October 15, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        It’s a pretty popular theory that people from professions such as especially engineers and doctors are more prone to extremist thinking. Sometimes weight is given to the idea that these sciences promote black/white thinking while the humanities promote more nuanced views of the world. Like any generalization, this probably has some truth but also is not entirely correct. Certainly one can come across a certain type of mindset which seems to lack the depth of appreciation for the nature of humanity that one would hope a deeper appreciation for arts would give one (see Yakoub’s central argument in this thread).

        At the same time, it also must be kept in mind that engineers and doctors are probably the most highly respected fields to go into in in much of the Muslim world and therefore to some extent attract the best students, but may also create a subset of people more frustrated with the disfunction of their own societies.

      • Arwi 9:07 pm on October 15, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        Funny, ALL the stupid fundis I’ve ever met – Muslim and Christian — have been science/technology/medical students or graduates.

        Wow, so the definition of being profoundly humanized is not being a fundi? Paul de Man sure must be happy with his free pass. And Harold Bloom.

    • Arwi 9:26 pm on October 15, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Arwi, I assure you I was not po faced…

      OK, OK. I was just trying to say that “The idea that morality is only for children and not for sophisticated adults is nonsense.” is true, and if you look at Wilde’s works, he agrees with you (and so do I).

    • plimfix 9:18 am on October 18, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      First off, apologies to anyone on here who thinks I was calling them a stupid fundi, except maybe Mr Lyons. I’m talking IslamSoc tantrumers and the Christian equivalent. Second, I feel that I have either been the victim of several fallacies of composition, or over-stated my case. Yes, all the nutjob fundis I’ve met have been engineers/scientists. Does that mean all engineers/scientists are fundis, or all fundis are engineers/scientists? No. Think Qutb. But I would argue having an insight into how language works and how other cultures function is an effective insulator against extremist viewpoints. Of course, scientists do read novels, books on social science, etc. But I wonder how many sec-gen E2L British Muslims struggle to access non-scientific learning, particularly when some communities hold it in such low esteem (unless its Law). Second, art is humanizing does not mean all art always all the time with all people. Nor does fiction make angels of people. But art/fiction is humanising enough, IMHO, to make it bloody important in the scheme of things.

    • Shams al-Nahar 9:48 am on October 18, 2010 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      But I would argue having an insight into how language works and how other cultures function is an effective insulator against extremist viewpoints.

      bravo, plimfix!
      yesssssssss.
      and to return to topic, scifi is my personal ultimate good, the fusion of science and fiction.
      like hiphop dance ……. all the past traditions of dance fused into carving realtime space with flesh.

  • aziz 11:31 am on December 31, 2009 Permalink
    Tags: , , science fiction   

    Has anyone read the novel by Ian MacDonald, Cyberabad Days? Saw an ad for it in the airport at Mumbai and was thinking about giving it a shot.

     

  • buzz 2:06 pm on November 4, 2009 Permalink
    Tags: , , , science fiction, stop-action opera   

     

    Deh putti di creetiores inna mi ear!

    Deh putti di creetiores inna mi ear!

    Need a laugh? Are you geek enough? 

    Kirk and super-Muslim Khan get it on I-talian style from Adult Swim’s Robot Chicken. Tutti Gusti!

     

  • aziz 9:15 am on August 11, 2009 Permalink
    Tags: , science fiction   

    even though Orson Scott Card is a raving Islamophobe, I do intend to re-read Ender’s Game and the new sequel Ender’s Shadow. I’ve got a sci-fi reading list of other books I need to get around to over at Haibane, and would welcome suggestions.

    Incidentally, another scifi author with a severe case of jafi-itis is Dan Simmons, author of The Hyperion Chronicles.

     

    • razib, murtad fitri 9:19 am on August 11, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      paolini seemed overrated to me (the fact that he wrote his first book as a teenager is cool, but i think that is what really lifted him off).

    • null 10:03 am on August 11, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Wow, that Orson Scott Card article you linked to was insane. Dude didn’t even feel the need to qualify with token weasel words about those nice moderate Muslims or nothing.

      • Safia 7:12 pm on August 11, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        I had no idea about Card. Dammit, Ender’s Game is forever ruined!

        • Naila 1:23 am on August 12, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

          Card is also Mormon…and psycho. He is one of the worst kind of academic out there. He politicizes the classes he teaches and he actively uses his fan base to promote hate. Ender’s Game is so overrated — I can see 14 year old boys loving it as their very first intro to war games and genocide (fun stuff) but in terms of character or even scene development, it is basically on par with Judith Collins or any number of trash fiction out there.

          Aziz, I don’t have sci fi books to recommend, but if you liked Ender’s Game, you might like an actually well written literary masterpiece dealing with somewhat similar themes. It’s called Blood Meridian.
          http://www.cormacmccarthy.com/works/bloodmeridian.htm

          • Naila 1:32 am on August 12, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

            Addendum: Even though Blood Meridian appears to be a historical novel (revolving around the genocide of American Indians), the time line is actually amorphous so that like many sci fi narratives, it appears to be taking place currently or at a time in the future.

            It is a postmodern postapocalyptic vision of actual historical events (the organized slaughter and scalping of Americans Indians by mercenary marauding gangs). The “Game,” if you will, is the winning of the West and the obliteration of the “enemy” and the along the way one is not sure who the enemy is.

            It is very much a war games novel with commentary on manipulation, propaganda, and obscene destruction, all of which become in the heat of battle and greed as surreal and unreal as a video game.

    • razib, murtad fitri 10:52 am on August 11, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      hm. i’m pretty blase about the political or social views of sf/fantasy authors. i mean, it is *speculative* fiction. j. r. .r tolkien was rather non-racist for his day, but the racial frame of the *the lord of the rings* is pretty obvious, and is even clearer in the silmarillion. card is also pro-intelligent design, which obviously miffs me. but he’s generally a good writer in the early ender books and bean books.

    • Shams al-Nahar 11:34 am on August 11, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Im totally immersed in the Takeshi Kovacs/Carl Marsalis metaverse lately….I adore Richard Morgan…..he loathes all stripes of fundamentalists…catholic, evangelical, AND islamic.
      Revolution is one of his core themes. ;)

    • Pretty Pink Unicorns 11:25 pm on August 11, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      He also hates gay people even though it’s blatantly obvious to most of his readers that he in fact likes the cock. Queer as a $3 bill, and even more venemous because of it.

      Not a few soapy men wrestling in the shower scenes in Ender’s Game neither. LOL.

    • thabet 11:56 pm on August 11, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Does bigotry diminishes creativity?

    • Dean Esmay 4:41 pm on October 19, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I found the Card article a weird mix between perfectly rational assertions and crazy ignorance and insanity. Sometimes it feels like that’s all the world’s full of anyway.

      What I found interesting was that Card’s actual proposal–that a religion can and could lose its protection as a religion if it failed to meet certain basic requirements–really rather unobjectionable. It is actually common all over Europe for there to be outright illegal religions, and it’s more common here than most people realize. A religious outfit can lose their tax-exempt and other status/protections if they are found not to be a legitimate religion.

      Actually having a law like he proposes wouldn’t be all that scary. What would be scary would be how it would be enacted and enforced, and why.

      As for Card being gay: I suspect that’s pure speculation on the part of his detractors. You have to be careful of doing that to any fiction writer. If the whole reason is some shower scene or something involving men, I’m sorry, that’s just irresponsible generalization.

  • johnpi 8:32 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink
    Tags: , , , , Muslim science fiction, science fiction, Science fiction and fantasy,   

    Photobucket

    A population of mature virgins and a culture of adult gender segregation are theorized to be the catalyst for the rising number of adult men having real-life “love affairs” with anime cartoon characters in Japan.

    Posting this here because Japan is not unique in having a reserved, conservative, gender-segregated culture, and interest in anime has been noted to be high among Muslims elsewhere on this blog, though no one has yet reported this phenomenon among the Muslim anime fan base.

    (More …)

     

    • cbarwa 8:36 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      interest in anime has been noted to be high among Muslims elsewhere on this blog

      Wow, didn’t know this; I wouldn’t have thought that anime would appeal necessarily to most Muslims, given the themes and the graphic content and style it has. Great genre though, hard to think one that pushes the boundaries and experiments as thoroughly at it does.

      • Shams al-Nahar 8:47 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        I am an otaku of Willow’s splendid manga.
        Someday it will be made into anime and she will be rich beyond dreams of avarice.

        • cbarwa 9:10 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

          I wouldn’t regard Cairo as an example of manga. I see it more in the form of graphic novels that deal with social and political issues like Persepolis, Palestine, Maus, King etc. which I think are great but have a different style and artistic conventions than manga.

          To my mind it is very recognisably European in a way that East Asian graphic novels and comic genres like Manga and Manwha are not (despite their European influences). The way gender relations and sexuality is portrayed is, for example, quite different.

          I really liked Cairo though; Pekar’s artwork was fantastic and it is one of the best non-colour graphic novels I have read.

        • pi.info 9:24 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

          I believe it was WIllow who said in a comment somewhere on Ti that setting restrictions on people such that they are required to remain virgins into their 30s is a human rights violation. I believe it was in relation to a story about Egypt where many young people have to wait until their 30s to get married due to lack of housing and lack of employment prospects.

      • Naila 7:50 pm on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        If you consider the fact that Indonesia has one of the largest Muslim populations, and the fact that East Asian dramas (Korean, Japanese, and Taiwanese) and animation are extremely popular there and in the Middle East, it makes perfect sense. There is nothing to say that Muslims are incapable of appreciating new forms of genres.

        Most anime do not push the boundaries of taste. Only hentai and adult-themed anime do that. And most young girls — regardless of religious background — enjoy romantic novels, even gender-amorphous ones like that of shonen-ai or yaoi.

        Most anime are very sweet stories about high school love (Hana Yori Dango, Hana Kimi) etc. And then of course, Miyazaki is famous around the world. Also Japanese and Korean dramas are very popular in the Middle East — the TV shows tend to have compelling story lines and are very tasteful and “conservative.”

        -So speaketh the anime fanatic

        • Shams al-Nahar 8:07 pm on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

          It is my dream to go to the Miyazaki Museum someday.
          There is an anime of the neko basu from Totoro that can only be viewed there.
          <3

          • Naila 1:37 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

            Shams, I have been to the Miyazaki Museum, and it is really worth a trip to Tokyo just for a visit there. Plan ahead and get tickets days or not weeks before because it is a relatively small museum and you have to have a pass.

            And if you are an anime fan, you should check out Tokyo anyway. There are neighborhoods full of anime stores and manga cafes where you can get a private booth and read all day and night. I spent quite a few days doing just that.

            • Shams al-Nahar 2:52 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink

              Nalia, shukran….have you considered a talkislam anime blog?
              I would be your otaku. ;)

            • Naila 11:51 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink

              Well, Shams, if you are offering to be my otaku…how can I refuse :-) .

              A talkislam anime blog? Hmm…great idea, but sadly I don’t have the time. My “contribution” to anime is behind the scenes — I am an editor and timer for a famous fansubbing team — and after that, I have no energy left — except to make comments on other people’s blogs.

              On topic, the NYTimes article is so annoyingly typical of how outsiders see otaku culture. The fact that this guy sleeps with a pillow is irrelevant to his fandom. I don’t think otakus are any more socially maladjusted than other kinds of people. Ah, NYTimes and its enforcing of reductive stereotypes.

            • Shams al-Nahar 11:57 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink

              lol!
              then at least you should comment at haibane.
              sometimes we can read my sempai, Steven Den Beste, the Greatest Otaku of Known Blogspace.
              I am aziz’s padawan learner in anime. ;)

            • Naila 12:50 am on July 27, 2009 Permalink

              Shams, I quickly looked over haibane and will certainly bookmark it for a future perusal and a typically long winded comment.

              In the meantime, you guys at haibane need to add crunchyroll to your blogroll! Some of the latest animes are simulcast there and in Japan — all fansubbed! DOOOOOO IT.

        • cbarwa 4:38 am on July 26, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

          If you consider the fact that Indonesia has one of the largest Muslim populations, and the fact that East Asian dramas (Korean, Japanese, and Taiwanese) and animation are extremely popular there and in the Middle East, it makes perfect sense.

          I didn’t realise that anime was so popular in Indonesia; being the most populous Muslim country this would obviously make a difference.

          There is nothing to say that Muslims are incapable of appreciating new forms of genres.

          Of course and no one said otherwise; I was just surprised that it was mentioned that there wa a ‘high’ degree of interest amongst Muslims in this genre.

          Most anime do not push the boundaries of taste. Only hentai and adult-themed anime do that. And most young girls — regardless of religious background — enjoy romantic novels, even gender-amorphous ones like that of shonen-ai or yaoi.

          Hentai is only a subset of anime and not typical imo; I would make a distinction between the manga market and anime; the former is much larger and more diverse, catering to different demographic groups with quite specific genres. Given the costs of prodcuction involved anime, the latter is more restricted in its output, at least in what is widely distributed outside Japan.

          Re taste; I suppose that depends on what you mean; I quite liked some yaoi anime like Kyo Kara Maoh which I thought were funny and very well done in how they ‘normalised’ non-heterosexual relationships, without any explicit depictions of sex. My experience though, is that there is a sharp divide on this with a lot of straight men/boys having a different reaction (of course yaoi is geared towards girls but still.) On the other hand I find a lot of yuri, even when aimed at the teen market, to be a bit dubious. Perhaps I am being a bit hypocritical though. I am alos showing my age, as there is far more anime available now for teenagers, than when I was one; the range was more restricted then, esp if you didn’t live in RoK or Japan.

          And yes, Miyazaki is fantastic, though I think perhaps not typical of many in the industry; depiction of violence and/or sexuality in his work always are located in his concern with various themes on the nature of peace and war, co-existence and people’s relationship with their environment. Very thought-provoking by any standards.

          Also Japanese and Korean dramas are very popular in the Middle East — the TV shows tend to have compelling story lines and are very tasteful and “conservative.”

          Well, true but this is typical of almost all day-time soap shows across the world; they tend to be relatively restrained and deal with the humdrum of everyday life. Even the more ‘glamourous’ ones, are really quite ‘conservative’ imo.

          • Naila 2:11 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

            Thanks for detailed response, CBarwa, — I think we are essentially agreeing.

            I didn’t realise that anime was so popular in Indonesia

            And in Malaysia as well. In the anime or Korean or Japanese drama fansites, a substantial number of fans are also Muslims from Singapore as well as the Gulf States. It is rare for me to come across South Asian fans of any background, but I come across many South Asia Muslims living in the Middle East. Many shows regularly air on TV in those countries.

            Given the costs of prodcuction involved anime, the latter is more restricted in its output, at least in what is widely distributed outside Japan.

            There is absolutely no restriction to distribution when it comes to anime or k- or j-dramas. Most anime is and always has been distributed on fansites via peer to peer file sharing or bittorrent and all anime and manga (scanlations) are available with fansubs within days of their releases. At any given moment, there are 1000s of fansubbers working on translating and then uploading shows.

            I have never had more than a week delay on getting a hold of any anime or manga I have ever wanted, and this is speaking as a 14+ years as fan.

            Anime fandom was always underground, and it is only in recent years that anime has gone mainstream (appearing on US channels like Cartoon Network). But most fans are still getting their anime from fansites and fansubbers. Of course we also buy box sets, and there are a couple of j-companies now offering simulcasts on the web for a nominal fee or for free.

            My experience though, is that there is a sharp divide on this with a lot of straight men/boys having a different reaction

            In my dealings with fans, I have never found male fans to be offended or discomfited by yaoi. In fact, it would be distasteful to the fandom culture. Just as hentai (even the tentacle ones) is never criticized. Most male otakus I know watch yaoi. Interestingly, it is American male fans who get their panties up in a bunch the most. Most Asian males are completely cool with them.

            Yaoi has one of the largest anime fanbase among girls, but keep in mind that in real life, yaoi-catering musicians like Gackt is just as huge with men.

            On the other hand I find a lot of yuri, even when aimed at the teen market, to be a bit dubious.

            Yuri does have less romance and more skin — but that is probably because it is geared towards men.

            Also Japanese and Korean dramas are very popular in the Middle East

            The Korean dramas exported in the Middle East are evening shows — primetime. I think the appeal is the FANTASTIC storytelling. Korean dramas like Jumong and A Jewel in the Palace are absolutely brilliant.

            Anyway, if you are fan, try to make connections in the fandom world and you will get invitations to join sites where you can access all the shows and manga you want. I cannot post URLs here though.

            • cbarwa 2:42 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink

              Thanks a lot for that Naila; it has been a while since I had anything to do with the anime scene, esepcially in the region – my introduction came as a kid many years ago in Singapore when my family was based there but this was in the pre-internet age so things have changed since then!

              There is absolutely no restriction to distribution when it comes to anime or k- or j-dramas. Most anime is and always has been distributed on fansites via peer to peer file sharing or bittorrent and all anime and manga (scanlations) are available with fansubs within days of their releases. At any given moment, there are 1000s of fansubbers working on translating and then uploading shows.

              I have never had more than a week delay on getting a hold of any anime or manga I have ever wanted, and this is speaking as a 14+ years as fan.

              Wow, that is impressive, had no idea there was such a network. My point was more geared towards the fact that getting animation companies and TV studios to invest in producing the anime was the main expense involved – especially since the companies need to recoup their investments and won’t make any money of file-sharing over the net amongst fans. Would it be fair to say that only a relatively small percentage of the manga output gets turned into anime? I notice that with technology and costs falling, more and more anime is getting made but this still must be a relativley tiny proportion of the total manga output – am I correct in this assumption?

              You are lucky to be linked to these networks; in Europe acquiring a reasonable range of manga is exhorbitantly expensive.

              In my dealings with fans, I have never found male fans to be offended or discomfited by yaoi. In fact, it would be distasteful to the fandom culture. Just as hentai (even the tentacle ones) is never criticized. Most male otakus I know watch yaoi. Interestingly, it is American male fans who get their panties up in a bunch the most. Most Asian males are completely cool with them.

              that is interesting, I can see why it might offend American male sensibilities which tend to be fairly conservative and rigid on these matter :)

              I mention it because I did a fair amount of babysitting for friends and colleagues when I was in India and one thing that surprised me was that many parents asked to make sure that this was one of the things their children didn’t watch on television while they were out. Personally, I didn’t see why it should have been a problem but of course I respected their wishes. Glad to see things are more relaxed in SE Asia!

              The Korean dramas exported in the Middle East are evening shows — primetime. I think the appeal is the FANTASTIC storytelling. Korean dramas like Jumong and A Jewel in the Palace are absolutely brilliant.

              I used to watch the historical and the martial arts serials; they were very good as well. Incredibly intricate storylines!

            • Naila 11:56 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink

              Would it be fair to say that only a relatively small percentage of the manga output gets turned into anime?

              I guess I misunderstood you earlier. Yes, you are totally right about that a relatively small number of mangas get made into anime!

      • aziz 10:14 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        oh, yes indeed Conrad – yes indeed: http://haibane.info

    • razib "the atheist" 10:32 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      adult virgins. lol.

      • cbarwa 11:04 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

        Really hope you weren’t drooling when you typed that Razib :D

    • johnpi 11:54 am on July 25, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Since most anime falls into the science fiction and fantasy literary and film genres, I’ve added the appropriate tags.

    • razib "the atheist" 11:12 pm on July 26, 2009 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      wow. swarming muznerdz in da house.

  • razib, murtad fitri 9:51 pm on August 17, 2008 Permalink
    Tags: , science fiction   

    section of an interview with sf author john c wright on his christian conversion:
    I knew the Christians were evil in theory; I could not explain how so much unique good came from them.

    Greatly daring, I attempted an experiment in prayer, addressing a Supreme Being I knew with deep certainty did not and could not exist. My prayer was quickly and awfully answered.

    A miracle occurred. I suffered a supernatural experience and found all the foundations of my carefully examined and rigidly logical philosophy swept away as if by a tidal wave of blazing and supernal light. A great and powerful spirit visited me.

    The whole thing was as simple and astonishing, as easy to explain and as hard to explain, as falling in love.

    I am one of those rare creatures whose belief in the supernatural is due to empirical considerations. My mysticism is entirely scientific. Alas, the second step in the experiment, when the miracle occurs, cannot be reproduced before the eyes of skeptics.

     

    • Willow 10:24 pm on August 17, 2008 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      That’s awesome. I know how he feels.

    • Muse 11:59 pm on August 17, 2008 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      I am one of those rare creatures whose belief in the supernatural is due to empirical considerations

      What empirical considerations?

    • razib 12:11 am on August 18, 2008 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      you can google it, but it seems like he feels he had a personal experience with god. that is, he experienced and encounter with god.

    • Willow 12:37 am on August 18, 2008 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      A miracle, assuming it has some kind of literal manifestation, would be empirical evidence of the supernatural. Ie not “i had a vision” but “this chair moved from here to there without help” or “In a dream I saw Cheng Fei lose the floor event by 1.25 points and the next day that’s exactly what happened.” In other words, some part of the event occurs outside the mind, making it measurable if not repeatable.

      I’ve been thinking about miracles a lot lately…

    • Willow 12:43 am on August 18, 2008 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Ooh I notice he makes the Tolkien-Lewis-Waugh connection. Most people only get as far as Lewis. It’s harder to see the Waugh link because he’s so much more ambivalent. If only he’d kept going and gotten to Lings, we might have had him for ourselves. ;)

    • Lawrence of Arabia 5:10 pm on August 18, 2008 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      “Alas, the second step in the experiment, when the miracle occurs, cannot be reproduced before the eyes of skeptics.”

      So much for the scientific part…or the empiricism. Wait, what was he saying again?

      LoA.

    • thabet 8:42 pm on August 18, 2008 Permalink | Log in to Reply

      Heh @ LoA.

      Isn’t he confusing ‘direct experience’ (experiential) with ‘science’ (empiricism)?

      The two are not the same, imho.

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