Dawkins et al bring us into disrepute. There’s a schism alright, and I seem to find myself on the unfashionable side of it - Michael Ruse
The question: Is there an atheist schism?
As a professional philosopher my first question naturally is: “What or who is an atheist?” If you mean someone who absolutely and utterly does not believe there is any God or meaning then I doubt there are many in this group. Richard Dawkins denies being such a person. If you mean someone who agrees that logically there could be a god, but who doesn’t think that the logical possibility is terribly likely, or at least not something that should keep us awake at night, then I guess a lot of us are atheists. But there is certainly a split, a schism, in our ranks. I am not whining (in fact I am rather proud) when I point out that a rather loud group of my fellow atheists, generally today known as the “new atheists”, loathe and detest my thinking….
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Richard Dawkins, unplugged. The video description:
Richard Dawkins talks about why it’s time for a book setting out the evidence for evolution, when calling someone ignorant isn’t an insult, and how the media have made him into a militant atheist
I am fascinated by the all-powerful ability of the media to “make” people into things. Almost like it’s a Creator, molding our souls from clay.
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Richard Dawkins doing his best to turn atheism into a full blown religion:
On a more serious note, this is tacit acceptance that people need to be schooled into a tradition which allows them to begin an inquiry.
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Dick Dawkins says that the Labour government must
(Via BTTL.)
Muslim groups that receive funding are doing so as part of the government’s counterterrorism and ‘anti-extremism’ policy, not out of a belief that religions should be privileged. You can criticise this approach, but at least get the rationale right.
The only “faith group” with any real privileges is the Church; but even that is due to our constitutional arrangements.
(I don’t know about the funding for Hindu, Sikh or Jewish groups. Funding for ‘faith groups’ probably overlaps any funding for ethnic groups.)
And how can Dawkins claim the government has been ‘toadying up’ to Muslims when you consider the legislation and illegal behaviour introduced by Labour; the language from leading Labour politicians; and the single biggest violent act carried out by this government, all of which have had a disproportionate impact on Muslims.
So why is Dick Dawkins repeating the sort of language — of a government and ‘establishment’ that is ‘caving in to’, or ‘toadying up to’, or ‘appeasing’ Muslims specifically* — that can be found on the pages of the BNP’s website?
*Notice how Dawkins is able to remember “Muslims” so easily. Why? Muslims make up about 3-4% of the population in England and less than 1% in Scotland. The largest ‘faith groups’ are going to be Anglican and then Catholic. There are bishops in the House of Lords; not imams.
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Andrew Brown notes that Dick Dawkins is calling for a ‘gloves off’ approach to the ‘irredeemably religious’ and those who are fence-sitters (last I checked the website wasn’t working for me).
Brown says that Dick Dawkins’ calls to arms shows the culture of contempt of the New Atheists, all the more odd given that these are the people who emphasis the need for ‘reason’.
I am more alarmed by the idea that Dick Dawkins seriously believes Ann Coulter is the ‘best’ individual to represent religious believers in a debate with permanently drunk chickenhawks or torture fantasists who look like average, overpaid, Hollywood comedy actors. That to me, if a serious comment, shows an alarmingly lack of width in Dick Dawkins’ reading of the broad category of ‘religion’.
But I would still side with Dick Dawkins against Mad Mel.
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This one is for Razib: Mary Midgley attacks Richard Dawkins (again).
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Oklahoma’s state legislature is investigating the University of Oklahoma for hosting a speech by Richard Dawkins.
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Richard Dawkins’ official website has been blocked in Turkey, following a complaint from the team behind the Harun Yahya organisation.
Stupid.
Usama Hasan, meanwhile, criticises Muslims for their “childlike” view of evolution, and science in general.
There’s an attempted response by Adam Deen, a Muslim blogger, to Hasan’s views on the need to reconcile evolution with their religious beliefs. Although, I am not sure it is much of a response, and only seems to underline Hasan’s argument about Muslims indulging in bad science…
Update: Abu Hasan in the comments links to another response to Usama Hasan’s article at Ummah Pulse. I don’t think the piece deserves any sort of serious analysis, but at least the author of that piece doesn’t copy and paste snippets of “evidence” found at creationist websites.
And please note: I am not saying Usama Hasan or his views are beyond criticism.
Related: See an earlier Talk Islam post on Richard Dawkins’ views about Muslim creationism and read about the role of the Turkish military establishment in pushing creationism into the mainstream.
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Richard Dawkins told a session of the Edinburgh International Book Festival that Europe was a “haven of civilisation” trapped between the Islamic world and the US.
Sticking with the evolutionary biologist, Razib has a Sokal-esque dig at his philosophical enemies, following news that Dawkins criticised Muslim parents for “importing” creationism into British classrooms. (Read the interview in full at The Times.)
I don’t have any data or information on Muslim views on ‘creationist science’ in the UK, although there have been some stories in the past reporting concern from lecturers about how Muslim and other religious students view evolution, especially those studying medicine or science subjects. Muslim media have also reported this dismissive attitude — a 2005 summer edition of Q-News apparently suggested that “Harun Yahya had, in the eyes of most ‘literate Muslims’, effectively defeated the arguments of Darwin”. Based on personal experiences, I would also agree that evolutionary science is probably widely dismissed by Muslim students, with many focussing on the ‘practical’ elements of, say, medicine or pharmacology.
But I don’t know if anyone has carried out any serious research into this area (Muslim views on creationism in the UK). And while I get Razib’s point about seriously considering the data on Turkey*, I just don’t think public champions of science like Dawkins can rest their claims about schoolteachers and Muslim pupils on a visit or two to schools — it’s just not good science.
Then there is the choice of words. For me, use of words like “import” is not dissimilar to David Blunkett’s talk of Britian being “swamped” by asylum seekers. Added to his claim that it is “impossible to say anything against Islam in this country” he is alluding the old argument that People Out There Are Threatening To Destroy Our Way Of Life. In fact, his claim that you can’t say what you want about Islam is, to put it very bluntly, bullshit. You can say whatever you want about Muslims and their beliefs and get it published as front page news; you can even peddle yourself as an expert in the media although you may know very little about the subject under discussion**.
This is not to say Dawkins or anyone else cannot have an open and frank discussion about Islam, or any other belief system, without the threat of legal reprecussions (i.e. freedom of speech) or the threat of violence***. But it is worth nothing that none of these debates — whether on the ‘veil’, or on offensive cartoons, or on works of literature — take place inside a vaccum. They have a context — local, national or global context — in which they can be analysed.
*For more on Turkey’s creationism see an earlier post on Talk Islam.
**This includes trivial mistakes and more serious errors.
***Protection from violence in this context can come under ‘legal reprecussions’ — the state is obliged to protect people who express views from such threats and also punish the perpetrators. How far does this legal protection include protection from social, political and economic reprecussions?
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Richard Dawkins has criticised Muslim parents for “importing creationism” into British schools.
