if so, then Awlaki has been behind Fort Hood and Times Square at least, if Im not forgetting any.
and everytime he recruits a American to his cause of domestic terror, its we muslim Americans who suffer.
Am finding it harder and harder to take issue with the kill order on his head. this guys has done more damage than Bin Laden, since 9-11.
Abu Noor Al-Irlandee
10:06 am on May 10, 2010 Permalink
Aziz, if random unsourced and unproven allegations are to be believed, which apparently you are saying they are, then Awlaki was also responsible for the attempted plane bombing and 9/11 itself. (This is of course not to mention the oil spill in the Gulf, which it would be naive to think he had nothing to do with).
And of course the president should be allowed to murder any Muslims who is rumored to be associated with any attack….I mean who could possibly be against that? Actually presenting evidence and trying people in a court of law is 9/10 thinking.
I was expressing a sympathy, not an agreement, with that issue.
To call the allegations against Awlaki unsourced is factually wrong; to call them unproven is technically correct, but a technicality nonetheless. Awlaki himself *praised* the Fort Hood shooter, and the Christmas Day bomber and Faizal Shahzad both have alluded to contact with him.
Awlaki hasnt put on a bomb himself – but his link to directly inspiring and encouraging American muslims to kill other people and engage in hirabah is about as plain a fact as a fact can be made plain. Denying it reduces our credibility to the level of those who insisted Jews left the Twin Towers.
I have a real problem with extra-judicial killing. I’m thinking the guy should be hauled in, given his rights, put on trial and convicted by a jury of his peers. Civilian juries have shown they can do the job just as well as some sort of military tribunal–and we don’t taint ourselves with vigilante justice.
However, I do think that bookstores and other outlets that sell al-Awlaki’s CD sets ought to be thinking REAL hard about it. Not that I won’t stop buying other books from those bookstores, but I just think it’s a Bad Idea.
book stores sell stuff written by hitler, don’t they? i think the main issue that this dude’s stuff isn’t about his radicalism, but highlights how integrated he was in american islam (or seemed to be, i don’t know enough about muslims to see if this was a big player, but it sure seems like he had a cultural impact).
Yes, they do. They also sell works by Marx and Engels. (*sigh* Still missing my red-covered “Marx-Engels Reader” 25 years later…) But I still remember the first time someone showed me his copy of Mein Kampf. I was 20. It was still a shock.
I think the difference between the two cases is that one guy is dead and people post parody videos about him on YouTube, and the other guy is still alive and people post his latest pontifications on YouTube. Ok, so maybe not so different….
Mirelle, I remain a big fan of police investigation, Miranda rights, and trial by jury – I do think that military tribunals get a bad rap, because they are trials by jury too, and in fact have better evidentiary benefits to the accused (but also have tighter limits on what can be made public – these things go hand in hand).
Im basically in favor of our existing judicial system – but the military branch of it, when applied to foreign combatants and US citizens engaged in terrorism.
aziz, 
mirelle, 
mirelle 7:51 am on May 10, 2010 Permalink
A number of websites are asserting that Faisal Shahzad had contacts with Awlaki.
ABC
aziz 9:53 am on May 10, 2010 Permalink
if so, then Awlaki has been behind Fort Hood and Times Square at least, if Im not forgetting any.
and everytime he recruits a American to his cause of domestic terror, its we muslim Americans who suffer.
Am finding it harder and harder to take issue with the kill order on his head. this guys has done more damage than Bin Laden, since 9-11.
Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 10:06 am on May 10, 2010 Permalink
Aziz, if random unsourced and unproven allegations are to be believed, which apparently you are saying they are, then Awlaki was also responsible for the attempted plane bombing and 9/11 itself. (This is of course not to mention the oil spill in the Gulf, which it would be naive to think he had nothing to do with).
And of course the president should be allowed to murder any Muslims who is rumored to be associated with any attack….I mean who could possibly be against that? Actually presenting evidence and trying people in a court of law is 9/10 thinking.
aziz 1:44 pm on May 11, 2010 Permalink
I was expressing a sympathy, not an agreement, with that issue.
To call the allegations against Awlaki unsourced is factually wrong; to call them unproven is technically correct, but a technicality nonetheless. Awlaki himself *praised* the Fort Hood shooter, and the Christmas Day bomber and Faizal Shahzad both have alluded to contact with him.
Awlaki hasnt put on a bomb himself – but his link to directly inspiring and encouraging American muslims to kill other people and engage in hirabah is about as plain a fact as a fact can be made plain. Denying it reduces our credibility to the level of those who insisted Jews left the Twin Towers.
mirelle 10:12 am on May 10, 2010 Permalink
I have a real problem with extra-judicial killing. I’m thinking the guy should be hauled in, given his rights, put on trial and convicted by a jury of his peers. Civilian juries have shown they can do the job just as well as some sort of military tribunal–and we don’t taint ourselves with vigilante justice.
However, I do think that bookstores and other outlets that sell al-Awlaki’s CD sets ought to be thinking REAL hard about it. Not that I won’t stop buying other books from those bookstores, but I just think it’s a Bad Idea.
Willow 11:42 am on May 10, 2010 Permalink
Thirded.
razib, murtad fitri 12:07 pm on May 10, 2010 Permalink
book stores sell stuff written by hitler, don’t they? i think the main issue that this dude’s stuff isn’t about his radicalism, but highlights how integrated he was in american islam (or seemed to be, i don’t know enough about muslims to see if this was a big player, but it sure seems like he had a cultural impact).
mirelle 6:33 pm on May 10, 2010 Permalink
Yes, they do. They also sell works by Marx and Engels. (*sigh* Still missing my red-covered “Marx-Engels Reader” 25 years later…) But I still remember the first time someone showed me his copy of Mein Kampf. I was 20. It was still a shock.
I think the difference between the two cases is that one guy is dead and people post parody videos about him on YouTube, and the other guy is still alive and people post his latest pontifications on YouTube. Ok, so maybe not so different….
aziz 1:45 pm on May 11, 2010 Permalink
Mirelle, I remain a big fan of police investigation, Miranda rights, and trial by jury – I do think that military tribunals get a bad rap, because they are trials by jury too, and in fact have better evidentiary benefits to the accused (but also have tighter limits on what can be made public – these things go hand in hand).
Im basically in favor of our existing judicial system – but the military branch of it, when applied to foreign combatants and US citizens engaged in terrorism.