Razib argues, christianity can sprea …
Razib argues,
christianity can spread among non-christians due to some latitude toward evangelists
but is that true? I don’t think there actually is that much latitude towards Christian evangelists among muslims, because of a fundamental difference in message tenor. From the muslim perspective, the Christian evangelists’ message sounds like a step backwards – the muslim already believes themselves to be an heir to Christianity’s spiritual message. Only muslims who have had some bad experience that they can blame on the faith are really susecptible to persuasion. I have no data to back this theiry up, but I suspect that most converts from Islam are weakly religious ones and those entering Christianity probably don’t become full-throated patricipants the way converts into Islam tend to be.
Islam doesn’t actually seem to have an active evangelist class that I am aware of, probably because Islam sells itself in marketing terms as an “upgrade path”. The overall higher degree of religious enthusiasm seen by muslims as a whole, compared to the general apathy of Christians in the West, is also something attractive to those with a spiritual yearning.
Fundamentally, then, Christianity has to say to a muslim, “you’re wrong” whereas Islam says to the Christian, “you’re more right than you realized.” It is this difference in basic message that accounts for the antipathy to Christian evangelists in muslim circles. I don’t know the poach rate of conversions between faiths but I doubt that Christianity makes significant inroads, apart from the disaffected “low hanging fruit” victimized converts who are really looking for an out from religious spirituality as a whole. I tried to look through the GSS database for data to support these assertions but I couldn’t find a variable relating to religious conversion.
I like to analogize this as the Mac vs PC argument (in this case, Islam being the Mac and Christianity being the PC).
Apple pitch to PC user: switch to the sexy newness. you can still run windows too, but you get so much more!
Microsoft to Mac User: you’re an elitst idiot for buying into marketing propaganda designed by a monomaniac. Come home to the old and fuddy-duddly. Look, we got Jerry Seinfeld!
thabet, 
aziz and 3 others are discussing.
razib 1:34 pm on December 12, 2008 Permalink |
I don’t think there actually is that much latitude towards Christian evangelists among muslims, because of a fundamental difference in message tenor.
well, in large swaths of the muslim world they’d be at risk of being lynched (as they do in parts of northern india). it isn’t because of message tenor
in bangladesh christian missionaries are allowed to preach to hindus, but they know they’d face violent communal repercussions if they attempted to preach to muslims (so they do it on the sly).
your model is eurocentric. plenty of muslims have converted to christianity in sub-saharan africa (conversion of muslim peoples in places like burkina faso are always big “wins” for evangelical groups). and since 1950 christianity has smacked islam down among ‘traditional religionists’ (this is most stark in nigeria, as all the ‘traditional’ people in the ‘middle belt’ now skew toward christianity, which has resulted in religious parity which discomfits the muslim northern elite). in java christianity has also gotten converts from muslims, albeit, from the more ‘syncretistic’ javanese whose relationship to islam soured after political persecution in the 1960s. i’ve told you before that in latin america most muslims have converted to catholicism (they’re syrian). in trinidad large numbers of muslim south asians (and hindus) have converted to christianity; i’ve met several trininadian brownz with ‘muslim’ names who are christian (one of them told me that his father’s parents had converted and he didn’t know much about islam).
the GSS sample sizes for muslims is pretty small. i looked in there too. but look at the switch-in vs. switch-out rates for various groups. also, the religious landscape survey suggests that muslims in america are actually somewhat less religious than many evangelical groups if 5% admit to being atheists (“cultural muslims” obviously).
Willow 2:34 pm on December 12, 2008 Permalink |
Conversion is not a rational experience. Christian evangelicals have come up with a very good sell–if you listen to their talk shows and telethons it’s quickly apparent. I don’t think it’d take much for a disgruntled or spiritually restless Muslim to go over. The natural evolution-mac-pc argument would mean very little to someone who was really unhappy in Islam.
Abu Noor Al-Irlandee 10:05 am on December 13, 2008 Permalink |
I agree with that completely. Although I would clarify that I don’t think it’s irrational..it’s just something different…it’s not, in my experience, based on logical argument…as few decisions that humans make, especially ones of any importance, are.
But you don’t see large numbers of Muslims converting, do you? Also, I’m not sure how good their “sell” is, I guess that’s subjective. I have never found it in the least bit appealing…even before I was Muslim. (although I was only a teenager).
thabet 12:34 pm on December 13, 2008 Permalink |
Christian missionaries are better at religious marketing.
aziz 11:25 pm on December 13, 2008 Permalink |
just a note, something not being rational is not necessarily irrational, it may just be arational. Subtle, but important difference.
thabet 1:53 am on December 14, 2008 Permalink |
I think this is a very important point.
None of us has sat down and worked out our most of our choices, tastes, likes, dislikes, etc into a water-tight rational framework (ignoring whether such a thing is possible).
Anna 11:00 am on December 14, 2008 Permalink |
I’m glad I found your blog discussion through google alerts. I have a website that discusses life post-evangelism, and I will put a link to this there as food for thought.